I’m giving the page a second section because page 1 was starting to behave oddly.
As always, wait at least 30 days from issue of the book before starting to discuss. And give our overseas friends some extra leeway: the distribution system doesn’t reach everywhere as fast!
Of course atevi have motorized vehicles — consider Bren’s famous bus! D’oh!
And the trucks/pickups, generally owned by the village or estate (instead of being single-person/family transportation), used for transportation of goods and a few people from and to the train stations.
And Lord Tatiseigi’s car (which is remarked upon several times, as something unusual), and all the times Bren and his aishid travelled in (pickup) trucks.
Humans and the earlier aijjiin didn’t want to facilitate the explosive spread of internal combustion engines with their attendant damages, and tried to do so by not building many good roads, especially longer regional or long-distance roads.
So the atevi had steam engines when humans arrived, and got sturdy internal combustion engine country-workhorse type cars from humans. Not giving them the blueprints for motorbikes or motorised dirt-bikes capable of using the rural footpaths could fit in with the general transportation strategy.
That still doesn’t explain no bicycles.
Consider the usefulness of cargobikes, and the highly successful countywide bike-train combination in the Netherlands, using (rental) bikes for the start and end of tge trip, and trains for the longer distance – that would work well within the atevi transport structure. Maybe too well, if the objective is to limit most people’s use of regular longer-distance travel.
Sorry, too long, and my boss called so I acvidentally published it and I’m now to late to edit it down. I’ll do better next time!
I like the new shorter posts and livelier discussion, even though it’s hard for me to keep it short!
Another thing is: Why are there internal combustion engines at all? Messy, noisy, complicated and expensive, especially when built in low volume. It would be way better to go the ecologically superior way of small electric powered vehicles, especially for the short distances involved. Bicycles would go a long ways in making transportation around town more efficient, and with a little electric support they are even better.
At the beginning of the 20th century on earth, battery powered cars were more advanced than fossil ones. They did lack range, though, so the fossil fuelled type gained more traction.
IC engines are cheap and produce a lot of power for their size. Electric requires sophisticated chemistry and fabrication technology to get on par with IC. So if you have available oil (or alcohol), IC is a “lower” technology solution.
There was another technology.
“A Stanley Steamer set the world record for the fastest mile in an automobile (28.2 seconds) in 1906. This record (127 mph or 204 km/h) was not broken by any automobile until 1911, although Glen Curtiss beat the record in 1907 with a V-8-powered motorcycle at 136 mph (219 km/h). The record for steam-powered automobiles was not broken until 2009.”
i remember a bit in Invader, where Bren goes to the observatory, and thinking that “electrics wouldn’t make this grade.”
also, the colonists were basically starting from scratch, and IC engines were the first logical step in creating further industries that would be needed for more advanced tech. they were also A) trying not to destabilize the atevi economy/culture, and B) using the slow dribble of tech as political leverage.
Since the atevi are advanced enough to get into orbit now, they might skip the internal-combustion mess and proceed directly to longer distance electric vehicles. Do they have the support structure to generate electricity and make good batteries without the IC infrastructure? How is their power usually generated?
The humans were sharing technology, based on the human archives of human history. We had a lot of combustion motors used for movement of goods, before widespread electricity generation and storage, enough to base a transport strategy on.
They were wise enough to try and avoid the pitfalls inherent in that, but maybe didn’t want to wander too far off the one archive ‘blueprint’ they had, for how to achieve their advanced state of technology without disastrous societal effects?.
I actually don’t recall specifics about propulsion for the bus or the yellow plane. The trains are steam?? Or did I just imagine that?
I think the trains are steam locomotives. IIRC, there’s an early book reference that the atevi either already had steam engines or were on the verge of them at the point of contact with humans. But by Bren’s time, they had trains, definitely. I don’t recall references to any other propulsion engine type (maglev, electric, etc.) for the trains.
Battery technology: We’re only just now on the verge of better batteries, with a couple of scientists working on a new technology involving liquid, IIRC.
Tesla is about to announce lithium ferrophosphate batteries that are cheaper and safer than heretofore used.
They’re looking at Edison’s nickel-iron batteries for storage. They don’t break down as quickly as the metal-hydride ones, and also can produce hydrogen.
Separate Point: One thing the humans were / are worried about was the chance that atevi might either leapfrog or find another tech method entirely, and jump ahead of old human tech in some area, thus more as time went on. But now that there is a rush parity, what if atevi do begin leaps or new method discoveries? It could benefit both sides, but it would surely give the atevi an advantage.
Reunioners brought energy tech with them. It remains to be seen what that means.
In addition to to human Earth plants, are there any animals? Hard to imagine a ship like Phoenix doesn’t have the ability to produce animals. There does seem to be awareness of ecological impacts, but sterile animals for companions would be an ‘obvious’ things to do. After all, a starship without cats is a poor sort of ship.
They may have something like chickens, going by the food available on Mospheira. They’ve probably been very careful about what they introduced to the planet. We know they have tomatoes, and probably peppers.
Is there any news on more books in the Foreigner series? I’m just rereading the entire sequence again, and really love that world. It would be fantastic to hear that more books are coming (soonest, please).
The latest hint is in https://www.cherryh.com/WaveWithoutAShore/happy-halloween/ but that’s in regards of preparing to start writing the next book. So, at least two years until publication of that one. I’m happy to buy the HC as soon as they become available, but won’t hold my breath as that’s detrimental to my health in the long run 😉
Yeah, probably January 2023. #sadface
Thank you both for the replies. I’m enjoying rereading the Foreigner sequence so much. Even have patience for the young heir and people like Toby, who I sometimes found irritating when reading the books more randomly. It is a truly extraordinary sequence of books. Malguri and Machigi’s realm particularly stay in the mind, in the descriptions of the places. I’m now on to Bren ‘facing off’ the Guild – love his team of Assassins. There’s enough ‘stress’ in each of the books to keep me happy.
I hope we have further books in the not too distant future.
Hope everyone is both safe and sane. And while I too will occasionally lament the lack of the next Foreigner volume, since Ms Cherryh and Ms Francher have to do the work, they get to call the shots. Writing is just plain hard work – and good writing, something we have come to expect from this crew, is even harder work. And there is already a very large and good body of writing to read and reread. Then too, Ms. Cherryh and Ms. Francher are not getting any younger as am I so we have to cut them a lot of slack.
Jonathan up here in rapidly cooling New Hampshire
Well, I’ve just finished reading the entire Foreigner series again. So much better than reading it piecemeal, and it has made me appreciate the books that I didn’t initially like as much as others. I’m now feeling bereft, and I’d so much like to see what happens next, after Divergence, since there’s an unfinished story there. Even one large volume rather than a trilogy could do it. I appreciate that it must be difficult for CJ at the moment, but do hope this isn’t the end.
I really don’t know what to read next, having also read the Alliance, Chanur and Faded Sun books right the way through. There’s none better for me than CJ …
I really enjoy reading the Foreigner series straight through too! I’ve done it a couple times as bedtime reading… extra nice is sometimes I fall asleep dreaming of the characters or the world.
That’s exactly when I’ve been reading the series. Only trouble is, I can’t put the books down so don’t go to sleep until about 3 a.m. I am now rereading them, again. Talk about obsessive, but every time I read them I find new things in them. Truly amazing achievement by CJ.
I read the entire Foreigner series end to end for the first time. I got more out of it that way, immersing myself in the story and characters. It was a confirmation of what an extraordinary work it is.
Where do you want us to document typos? I found two but not can’t find the paper I noted them down on…
I’m about ready to start a complete re-read of the series, while wishing for more.
No one has posted on here about the books for a while and I have a couple of queries. Machigi’s bodyguard, when Bren first met them, was portrayed as quite ‘noble’ (Temma and the others), but in Resurgence, I think it was, his guards were portrayed merely as ‘rough characters’, and there was no sign that Bren or any of his guards even recognised any of them (in fact, I believe their names were even different, and wouldn’t Machigi always have the same trustworthy atevi with him to guard him?
The other thing is, what has happened to poor Boji? I’d love to see him settled somewhere where he would be happy and not lonely, and where the heir could perhaps visit him.
P. S. I’m on a re-read of the last few books, and must say that, among others, Peacemaker (where Bren and his bodyguards go into the Assassins’ Guild building) is a splendid title, among many that are great.
I think my favourites take place without the inclusion of too many humans, other than Bren. The Atevi themselves, and their world, are so interesting and well developed.
Long may we have more from CJ!